Released Players

[chris]

By my reckoning a reasonably decent team could be raised from players released by Lancashire and still playing in the championship:

Hameed, Reece, Dearden, Mullaney, Critchley, Procter, Clark, Simpson, Parkinson, Kerrigan, Griffiths

squad: McKiernan, Aitchison, Lilley, Guest
soon to be added to by Davies and possibly Moulton.

So how many have progressed since leaving Lancs:

Yes: Hameed, Reece, Mullaney, Simpson, Guest. 
No decision/No: Griffiths, Procter, Clark, Kerrigan, Lilley
Never even near Lancs 1st team, but played although age groups: McKiernan, Dearden, Aitchison, Critchley, Parkinson so have clearly better first class career away for OT.

Kerrigan clearly had a better career at Lancashire but has been rehabilitated at Northants, so perhaps progressed, similar to Hameed at Notts.
Lilley, Procter and Clark doing much the same.
Griffiths never played first class for Lancs.

Would be good if they played a game at the end of each season!  Past v Present.

[lancsdes]

Good post Chris. Decent team but not a world beating team. As I’ve said before, there is too much talent in Lancashire (and probably Yorkshire as well) and although you have to be very good to have a chance to make it, you need a hell of a lot of luck as well.

The problem partly is that you lose the better players semi permanently to Test /pub cricket. So it is very difficult to judge against your team. I would say that Bohannon, Mahmood, Matt Parkinson, Lavelle despite his struggles this week, Bailey are better or potentially better than some of the players named. I also think Danny Lamb could be better than Luke Procter or Jordan Clark. Of course, it isn’t easy to assess future value to the county because of the hundred rubbish and central contracts.

I’ve not even mentioned the most talented of all and the biggest waster of all; Livingstone.

[exile]

Yes, Lancs will always produce more good players than they can use and some will be released to pursue successful careers at other counties, e.g. Steven Mullaney, Ronnie Irani, but there is also a worrying trend at Lancs to get rid of good players for non-cricketing reasons, such as personality clashes with authoritarian management or even just saying the wrong thing in public.  This trend is reinforced by the regular appointment to management positions of "loyal" former players.  Lancs desperately need managers and coaches appointed for their ability, rather than their loyalty.

[alanw]

Very interesting post. I agree with Exile that Lancashire will always produce more players than they can employ and counties with smaller catchment areas will always benefit and it's been like that since I started supporting Lancs. As well as Irani I can remember Mark Crawley, Andy Hayhurst and Stephen Titchard all leaving because they couldn't get regular first team cricket and having successful careers at other counties Crawley and Hayhurst both captaining their adopted counties.

The list of names in Chris' post are interesting. I don't remember Griffiths playing until he played in the successful T20 finals day in 2015 when he did a really good job. I think he was then injured the following season and didn't get back in the team on a regular basis. If he was on the Lancs staff now I would put him behind Saqib, Bailey, Gleeson, Wood, Lamb and of course Jimmy.

I don't think there is room for both Callum and Matt Parkinson on the same staff. But if our Parky becomes a regular for England and IPL then I would be wrong.

Luis Reece would certainly be an asset for us now. I can't remember the circumstances around his departure. It's an off the wall idea but I have wondered whether he could be recruited again and become the next Lancs captain.

Jordan Clark I think left on his own accord. I thought it was a strange move for him to go to Surrey after he had become fully established in both our red ball and white ball sides but things seem to have worked out for him down South.

If Simon Kerrigan was on our staff at the moment he would be behind Parky and Hartley.

Aaron Lilley I never really though he made the grade. Aggressive batsman in T20 but did not come off often enough and his bowling has never really been good enough.

Hameed is the difficult one, a change of scene has rejuvenated his career. His performances for Lancashire had become untenable if that is down to the Lancashire coaching staff or not is difficult to say.

[exile]

Reece is a good example of a promising player got rid of for non-cricketing reasons (apparently offending the management by punching his locker - in reaction to getting out - and breaking his hand).  Hameed is a difficult one but there seems to have been a breakdown of relations between him and our batting coaches, with Lancs implying that Hameed took more notice of his dad than of the coaches (looking at our batting, who could blame him?).  Funnily enough, this hasn't been a problem at Notts.  It seems to me that in professional sport the job of managers and coaches is to get the best out of the players, some of whom are going to be highly strung, and that adopting militaristic and authoritarian attitudes is not usually the way to do this.  It never seems to have occurred to the Lancs management that the fault lay with anyone but Hameed.

[richard]

No idea at all about Hameed’s dad, but if there was anything in it, then perhaps moving away from home has helped. Maybe ?

[exile]

When Hameed moved to Notts, Peter Moores immediately told the Nottingham Post that he was perfectly happy for Hameed to continue to work with his dad. Absolutely the move has done Hameed good but it reflects very poorly on the hopelessly unimaginative thinking and lack of empathy at Lancs. 

[oldhamexile]

Really interesting thread. I read an interview with Matt Critchley, who could be considered as slipping through our fingers, who said he understood why Lancs had chosen Matt Parkinson, and I guess you probably only have room for one young leg spinner.

Jordan Clark is the one that got away for me. Luke Wood has done really well at 7 in the championship but there's a real premium on genuine all rounders, not as many of them around as you might think. For me Clark's bowling has really come on while at Surrey and he can be a real handful.

I also think it's a real failure not to bring coaches and managers in from outside the county. Most successful management teams have diversity of approach, opinion and thought, and it's difficult to get that if everyone came through the same system.

And Hameed. I've long said that England and English cricket has failed black and asian cricketers. Completely agree with the post above that a strict regimented, one size fits all approach doesn't work, or bring the best out of people.

[man in the stand]

"Jordan Clark I think left on his own accord"

I'd heard that his girlfriend lived down South and that was the reason he departed. In any team you are going find that some won't make the grade or that there is isn't space in the team for them. So it is understandable they are people are let go... Hameed was a loss but I suspect he'll be playing for England more than Notts in future.

[exile]

Sept 9, 2021 14:24:19 GMT man in the stand said:

In any team you are going find that some won't make the grade or that there is isn't space in the tea, for them. So it is understandable they are people are let go... Hameed was a loss but I suspect he'll be playing for England more than Notts in future.

A case of the cup running over?

I daresay Notts won't see a lot of Hameed but it still doesn't reflect well on the Lancs management.

[alanw]

Sept 9, 2021 12:20:39 GMT exile said:

Reece is a good example of a promising player got rid of for non-cricketing reasons (apparently offending the management by punching his locker - in reaction to getting out - and breaking his hand).  Hameed is a difficult one but there seems to have been a breakdown of relations between him and our batting coaches, with Lancs implying that Hameed took more notice of his dad than of the coaches (looking at our batting, who could blame him?).  Funnily enough, this hasn't been a problem at Notts.  It seems to me that in professional sport the job of managers and coaches is to get the best out of the players, some of whom are going to be highly strung, and that adopting militaristic and authoritarian attitudes is not usually the way to do this.  It never seems to have occurred to the Lancs management that the fault lay with anyone but Hameed.

Totally agree with this cricket coaching/ managing isn't just about technical knowledge the man management and motivation aspect is equally important. I come from a scientific/ engineering background where often excellent engineers were promoted and became terrible managers.

[lancsdes]

Exile, my dad was moaning that Lancashire preferred forelock touchers a long time ago. Not a recent phenomenon.

[lancsdes]

Sept 9, 2021 14:13:52 GMT oldhamexile said:

“And Hameed. I've long said that England and English cricket has failed black and asian cricketers. Completely agree with the post above that a strict regimented, one size fits all approach doesn't work, or bring the best out of people.”

Assuming you read the Guardian article that Chris posted on Black cricketers a few days ago on here 0E? 

[alanw]

Sept 9, 2021 17:27:05 GMT lancsdes said:

Exile, my dad was moaning that Lancashire preferred forelock touchers a long time ago. Not a recent phenomenon.

I think that was true in the 1980s. I hoped that the likes of Allott and Chapple who experienced the short comings of that sort of regime would have moved things on. Perhaps cricketers are more professional now but the coaches aren't.

[sillypoint]

I see that Luke Procter is averaging 81.50 with three centuries this season, sitting 3rd in the Division 1 averages. Signed a new 2-year contract with Northants, described by his coach as a leader both in the dressing room and on the pitch, although, interestingly, not made captain. We can't keep everybody, so all you can say is well done to him for making the best of his career.